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• 03-13-2009, 1:44 PM

  In reply to

  Rovastar Joined on 03-13-2008, 10:00 AM London, UK Posts 1,775

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact ianderson: Also, I am a bit confused as you state "I can reproduce your problem" and then say "You need to find a pattern where it is reproducable". It is an intermittent issue and following the steps I described it is reproducable. As VorlonShadow mentions, the logs and tracing do not provide much insight into this issue.   I meant that certain pages on your site don't appear to do this. Others do - more static pages don't seem to have a problem. I do not know enough of the code to understand this more. Thus blank statement that it effects IIS7 and FF 3.0.6+ always are misleading. I have a site with .net and IIS7 and FF 3.0.7 and I do not get the same problems? Why is that? We need to break the problem down into more detailed segment to work out which area is problematic. Everyone is using .NET so there may be an issue with the stack there under certain conditions. BTW Are you using Integrated mode or are they separate? ianderson: The idea that there is no issue between FireFox 3.0.6 and IIS7 seems a bit odd, considering that I am experiencing it, our site users are experiencing it, and other developers are experiencing it. There clearly is some issue... the question is what is the cause of the problem.   Maybe there are closely related but I am not sure they are the same if that make sense. There seems to be other elements in this too and I am trying to work out what elements are causing the problem. For example I can very regularly reproduce the problem (in certain situations) on your site but VorlonShadow it appears very much more intermittent. For him It seems so far that there is a delay from when the initial packet is send to the server and IIS receiving and processing it. Is that the same for you? ianderson: Also... just to rule out any programming or client-side issues, as both Vorlon and I have already mentioned, the issue disappears when switching between IIS6 and IIS7. I have run the site on an identical setup, using the exact same code, on IIS6 and cannot produce the issue. It is specific to hosting on IIS7. In fact, I even tried hosting on IIS7 in IIS6 classic-mode but also experienced the issue. So I guess there is a chance that it is a problem with the Server 2008 networking stack and FF... since IIS7 and Server 2008 are inseparable there's no easy way to determine where the problem lies. That is interesting that it occurs in the IIS6 mode on Win2008. I do not know about the differences between what happens running in IIS6 mode but there must be some similarities. But this leads me to think that it may be something to do with IIS. Could you also tell me does it occur on the server itself? Could you install FF on there and reproduce the issue. It *could* I suppose also be the network card on the machine maybe it is delaying something getting to the IIS. Is there anything in the perfmon for the queue times when you have this problem? The behaviour look a little like this. What would be useful is if you code generate a more simple pick of code, that could be tested. Maybe just a dummy database and 1 page that causes the problem. Sorry if I sound a little curt in the replies I am just trying to understand the issue. http://www.iisportal.com

• 03-13-2009, 1:56 PM

  In reply to

  ianderson Joined on 09-23-2003, 7:53 PM Posts 22

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact I have tested it across different servers, with different network card setups and it occurs on both. I have also tested it in a virtual environment vs a physical machine and it occurs across both. I am not certain if it occurs on the server itself... I'll see if I can setup FF on the server to see if I can reproduce the issue. I'll also see if I can setup a simple page to try to test with.

• 03-13-2009, 2:08 PM

  In reply to

  VorlonShadow Joined on 12-27-2007, 1:19 PM Posts 64

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact I appreciate ianderson chiming in again. That's exactly the same way I feel.  I think these are the same issues, and he could be right about it being a networking problem with WS08.  If it were, then it would probably explain a couple of other errors that I've been getting on this server as well that are not happening on WS03.  I didn't bring those up right now because I thought it might muddy the waters, but I'm going to anyway.  The other two errors that I get are: System.Runtime.InteropServices.COMException (0x800703E3): Unknown Error and System.Runtime.InteropServices.COMException (0x80070040): The specified network name is no longer available. (Exception from HRESULT: 0x80070040) Both of these errors occur when the server is busy.  I haven't gotten them again since we aren't using the server any more for a particualr application.  I've got that same application on a WS03 server, and it's working perfectly. These errors may be related to the other issue, but I'm not sure. Anyway, I've checked my netmon capture log, and I've filtered it to only show HTTP requests/responses. However, I'm not 100% sure how to read it.  It has a time offset field, it doesn't show the actual clock time, so how do I figure out what time the activity occurred?  My guess is that the time offset is in seconds. So, looking at this, I can see when a request was made and when a response was sent, and I can tell how long it took.  However, I don't see the clock time that the request/response was made.  All of the response times are very small here,  and without being able to track down the clock time, I'm not sure how to tell which entry could be the one started at 8:50. Jesse

• 03-19-2009, 1:41 PM

  In reply to

  VorlonShadow Joined on 12-27-2007, 1:19 PM Posts 64

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact OK, I've just had it happen again, and I had netmon running for several hours before that.  So, I've got TONS of data.  After making a change to one of my .aspx pages, I hit the F5 button to refresh the screen, and got no immediate response.  It started at about 1:13pm, and I waited for SEVERAL minutes  I wasn't staring at the screen the entire time, so when it actually responded, I really don't know.  But, I do know that by 1:24pm, it had responded,and before 1:18pm, it had not Now, I've got all this netmon data. What am I looking for? I have checked all of the Windows logs. There is nothing in there for this time.  I have checked the IIS logs, there is also nothing important in there.  The entry for this access is as follows: 2009-03-19 17:23:03 192.168.1.8 POST /dlg/tsanat/MemDepGLDet.aspx - 80 - 192.168.1.105 Mozilla/5.0+(Windows;+U;+Windows+NT+5.1;+en-US;+rv:1.9.0.7)+Gecko/2009021910+Firefox/3.0.7 200 0 0 1575 Once again, this appears to indicate a 1.575 second time to  respond.  So, as indicated earlier, the possible problem appears to be between the request time and getting to the server.  So, maybe the answer is in the netmon data if I only knew what I was looking for?? Jesse

• 04-10-2009, 7:45 PM

  In reply to

  VorlonShadow Joined on 12-27-2007, 1:19 PM Posts 64

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact I guess I've stumped the experts!  There has been no activity on this issue for a while, and I continue to experience the problem. Surely there has to be some way to track this down and fix it??? We just bought a new server.  In the light of the sort of issues we've been having with IIS8, we decided to get WS03 instead of WS08.  However, we still need to deal with the WS08 server we've got now, and I seriously need help figuring this out.  It's really costing me a lot of time. Jesse

• 04-13-2009, 3:10 PM

  In reply to

  ianderson Joined on 09-23-2003, 7:53 PM Posts 22

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact It seems like this is one of those issues that falls somewhere between 2 companies. It is either something with FireFox or IIS7 and both sides can point to the other as the culprit. This leaves affected users (and developers) out in the cold. I tend to put this one on FireFox, although I would have appreciated some more help from the IIS team to try to determine what the root cause. Frustrating...

• 04-13-2009, 3:57 PM

  In reply to

  Rovastar Joined on 03-13-2008, 10:00 AM London, UK Posts 1,775	Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact Personally I think that this is something to do with the app as well. There are millions of IIS7 sites out there that don't have this problem with FF. But on your winbid site I can recreate it all the time. If you can post here/send me a small basic sample of a test case where this happens then I will take a look. http://www.iisportal.com

• 04-13-2009, 4:10 PM

  In reply to

  ianderson Joined on 09-23-2003, 7:53 PM Posts 22	Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact Sure, it could be something with our app. Something that is specific to IIS7, and FireFox (only recent builds), and something that has nothing to do with the client-side HTML code (as the client code works fine when hosted on IIS6). Given all of that, do you have any ideas about where the source of this bug might lie? That would be helpful.

• 04-13-2009, 4:37 PM

  In reply to

  Rovastar Joined on 03-13-2008, 10:00 AM London, UK Posts 1,775

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact To be honest I don't know. I suspect that certain app (I am guessing in asp.NET) configurations are run slightly differently under IIS7/windows 2008 (it could even be at the http.sys level) and newer versions of FF interpret these slightly differently which cause errors. So it could be an issue with any of these issues. I suspect that a slight change in the code and these problems will go away. Therefore I would break the site and therefore the problem down in smaller pieces and get the smallest possible areas where it still occurs. Analyse this from the packet level to see if there are any more clues. (I am slowly writing a blog article on using netmon to help with IIS problems but there were a few quirks with netmon and I have been speaking to their product team and evangelists in netmon in an attempt to make the system easier to understand) http://www.iisportal.com

• 04-30-2009, 4:20 PM

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  pbreitz Joined on 04-30-2009, 8:08 PM Posts 8

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact After months of casual searching, I finally typed in the right phrase, and found someone else with the same problem.  Alas, it looks like you haven't found a solution yet either. I've actually got a slightly different setup: Firefox3 IIS7/Win2008 Codlfusion8 Hearing that you're getting the same thing with .net leads me to believe that this issue has nothing to do with appilcation code.  Furthermore, I get the issue sporadically across dozens of applications that have been written over the past 5 years.  The same code works just fine on IIS6/Win2k/CF8 I just got around to installing WireShark right before I found this post, but haven't had a chance to isolate and capture the issue yet.  I did however install sysinternals process monitor on the server and watch the issue occur. The server has such a small load that I'm able to watch the processor spike whenever a request comes in, and sure enough... flatline until right before the request finally came back to the browser. I don't suppose anyone has had a revalation on this issue since the last post?

• 04-30-2009, 4:48 PM

  In reply to

  pbreitz Joined on 04-30-2009, 8:08 PM Posts 8	Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact One more quick thought... is anyone else experiencing this issue running the URL rewrite extension? Trying to think if there's some common variable aside from the standard IIS7 install that could be contributing to this.

• 04-30-2009, 5:26 PM

  In reply to

  ianderson Joined on 09-23-2003, 7:53 PM Posts 22	Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact Not using URL Rewrite here. I think this issue is more common than people realize. As you discovered, it is hard to classify or search for, and is often quickly dismissed as an "application problem". Hope you have some luck at diagnosing it!

• 05-04-2009, 8:18 AM

  In reply to

  VorlonShadow Joined on 12-27-2007, 1:19 PM Posts 64	Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact  I'm not using URL re-write either, and I've experienced the problem with .net, standard .asp, and I believe once even on a standard .htm page.  So, I agree that it does not seem to be code related.  Jesse

• 05-05-2009, 4:13 PM

  In reply to

  ianderson Joined on 09-23-2003, 7:53 PM Posts 22	Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact I installed WireShark and captured the issue, although I don't know enough about TCP to make much sense of it. I can see a bunch of TCP Retransmission messages, which don't occur during normal traffic. I would be happy to send the WireShark file to anyone who can help diagnose the problem.

• 05-05-2009, 5:07 PM

  In reply to

  ianderson Joined on 09-23-2003, 7:53 PM Posts 22

  Re: Pages appear to stop responding Reply Contact I have removed all application-code from the loop. I have a test page that is just the HTML source of one of our results pages. It is set to POST back to itself. There is no application-code, no code-behind, and nothing executing on this page on the server. It is only labeled with an .aspx extension to allow an HTTP POST to occur (as IIS disallows POST to .html docs by default). The issue still occurs: http://www.winebid.com/test.aspx I still believe this to be a communication issue between IIS7/Server 2008 and FireFox 3+.